Building Connection: Mark Mallchok’s Audience-First Approach to Corporate Events

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Welcome to the Event Pro show, your ultimate guide to the world of corporate

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events. Whether you're a corporate event planner, experiential marketing

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pro, producer, technician, or anyone involved in creating exceptional

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events, this podcast is your go to resource for valuable insights,

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expert tips and inspiring stories from the industry's leading professionals.

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Well, thank you for joining us on this episode of the Event Pro Show. I'm

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very excited about this week's guest. Someone I met this

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year at wec, runs an awesome company that

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I'm learning more and more about. Mark's bio.

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Mark, I'll just, I'll just give your bio here so people know what direction you're

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coming from. Mark co founded Brella in

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1992, Brella Productions in 1992 with CEO and President

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Bernadette Burke. A veteran producer and director, he's directed

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engaging corporate meeting and event experiences around the world for notable

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healthcare, financial services and heavy industry clients.

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He draws on his theatrical and film background to find

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compelling stories that anchor client projects and support their business

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and learning goals. He specializes in audience and participant management,

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combining powerful technical tools with rock solid narrative and performance

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techniques to deliver unparalleled face to face

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virtual and hybrid experiences. Well, Mark,

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welcome to the show. Thanks, Seth. And that was a

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mouthful. That was a lot of stuff. I like it. I like it though. It's

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only a paragraph. That's pretty good. You know, you go three paragraph

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gets a little, just a little iffy and it's, it's

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true too because you guys do such a good job. I was a guest on

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one of your webinars recently and I felt so

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taken care of. Just as a presenter. You guys are just total

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pros. Not just for, you know, the final product from the, the attendee

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standpoint, but from like the presenter standpoint. It was just great. It

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was a great experience. So you guys are awesome. I appreciate that.

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Yeah, I have a great team. We've been doing some really fun stuff and actually

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that is our ethos. Like we want to take care of everybody as part of

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the event, not just the audience.

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Also everyone who's participating in it, our clients and everyone

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working it. Because if it's not a lot of fun to do the event, it's

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going to come through to the audience. I know you have a lot of experience

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in this space and the Event Pro show is

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designed to be content for event

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professionals, a lot of event planners. But the, our, our guests tend to be

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people that in some way shape or form touch corporate events.

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And so I know you have a lot of experience around that. But I'd like

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to ask a question just as a setup to every guest. It's like a

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baseline question, you know, and I think it's, it's the most fun part of the

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show for me. But what is the first event that you

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can remember attending? And I'm looking for something like back when you were a kid

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or you know, like your earliest memory you can possibly think of. And what was

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that? How did it make you feel? You. Yeah. And

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I'll be honest, it was actually a little hard because it wasn't just one, it

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was lots of small little ones. And I'll give you the back. So I

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was lucky enough to grow up in Hawaii, on the big island of Hawaii, where

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my parents were librarians at a boarding school. So I grew up

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participating in every single activity

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as part of the faculty family. Like we lived off campus, but we like ate

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breakfast there, we went to school there, we ate dinner there with the high schoolers

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at a family style table. And, and we participated in every

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single performance and activity. So like each one of those was like a

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mini event. So I grew up literally on stage

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and participating in events like through

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grade school. And I moved very quickly in helping

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setting them up and planning and running them. And that's where I really fell in

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love with theater and events. It also helped that my mom worked for

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a while at a professional theater performance venue doing tech. So

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like designing sets, painting them and lighting them. I remember vivid,

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like going to that theater and like watching her set all this stuff up and

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like being in the audience or being backstage or being on stage.

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Right. For all of these plays. So I was able to be part of all

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of those events there. So I basically grew up on stage and

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backstage. I love it. It's in your blood. It is

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completely. That's so cool. And that's, that is not everybody, not

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some people grew up in it and have it like you like have it in

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the family. Some people kind of fell into it. Some people decided

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like mid career this is what they want to do. It's cool. Everybody's

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entry point into events and kind of how that impacts

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how you look at events even now. But, but as far as

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your experience, you're growing up, you're. You're doing, you

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know, things that you think, you know when you're little. I think sometimes the way

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I thought is like, this is how every family is, but you know, like you're

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doing things you're taking for granted. But at some point you said, this is what

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I want to do as a career. Is that something that happened? You young or

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did. Did you come back to it after doing some other things?

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No, I mean, I pretty much always knew it. Like, I. I remember, like, going

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over with a bunch of, like, my sister and my friends, and we put on

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a play at a neighbor's, like, patio there. Lanai. Right. Like, I remember doing

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that. And again, you know, I grew up doing all of

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that stuff. I knew through, like, middle school and high school, I was like, it's

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setting up for dances and plays and performances. I was in every

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club that you could that had any sort of, you know, event sort

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of aspect to it. I was in yearbook, I was in choir. I was in

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theater. I was in a club. I was shooting all the games. I was doing

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all these sports. Right. But anything that needed to be

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coordinated, I was that guy. Like, I always wanted to, like,

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manage the process. And I think the turning point was, you know,

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for a really long time, I wanted to be an actor. I went to Northwestern,

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which was like, the top theater school. Like, for a long time I

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wanted to be an actor. And then I discovered during that process, during

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college that I was actually better. And I enjoyed a

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lot more the planning and directing of the shows

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and doing filming and editing of videos and putting on this

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stuff, because it allowed me to craft the story

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and have a greater impact on the audience than I did if I was just

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on stage. Also, it guaranteed that I'd actually be able to

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eat and pay for what I love to do versus being a starving actor.

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So that was kind of the turning point in college is I was like, I

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know I want to do this very quickly. I

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think there's so many people in an event,

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event production, wherever, whatever type you do that were

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some type of performer. And whether that's theater, like you, or

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music, my case did a lot of music. But I,

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I. There are similarities or parallels between the way you

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feel after a show as a performer and as

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a technician or a producer. You're done with something

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that was highly. Took a lot of work, a lot of effort. You were putting

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yourself out there to some degree. You took a risk, you know, this could fail

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kind of a thing. And that's very performance, you know, as a performer. That too.

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And at the end, I. There's that camaraderie, too, that I. That is the

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same as a performer, I think, a lot of times with actual

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technicians or producers or people there behind the scenes too.

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Do you, do you find that. Oh, completely, yeah. Yeah. I mean, one of the

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big things Because I always get asked, you know, by

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people, like, getting into the business and so forth, like, what are some of the

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big things that you should be doing? And I was like, absolutely. The tech

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is there, you need to know that. But the thing that I recommend is

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always try to get some sort of performance, because not only does

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it help you to coach what people are feeling doing on stage and how

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they're acting on stage and how they interact with the audience, but it helps make

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it easier to communicate. Yeah, you put yourself in their shoes, but it just makes

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it easier to understand your craft. Right. Like, the more you can understand about whether

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it's theater, music or the tech side of things, it doesn't make any difference.

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Like, we're all in this idea of creating a performance. When we

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take on a new project, we call it a show from the very

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beginning. Right. Whether it's an event or a meeting, it doesn't matter. It's a show,

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it's a performance. Right. And everybody is part of that ensemble. Doesn't matter

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if you are the one speaking or the one, you know, who is managing

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the mic so that somebody can be heard, they can be lit, they can be

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seen doing the camera work. It doesn't matter. You're all part of this

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big ensemble. And I love that part of being part of the ensemble

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and, you know, having everyone participate in it. Because again, you get this

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aha moment at the end of like, woohoo, you know, we did it. It's that

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old analogy of like, I've got a bar and I've got some costumes, I have

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a friend who's got a whatever and like, let's put on a show. That's right.

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That's what every single one of these is. It's

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amazingly fun to do it. Yeah. Even when it's long hours

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in the basement of a hotel and you never see the light of day, that's

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being a blast. I think people get addicted to it too, because that. That feeling

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at the end and there's something special about, okay, this was something that didn't

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exist in the world. We put all of this energy into

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it and it turned into something. And then there's that magic element when you add

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people to the mix, to the room, then something even cooler

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happens and you created something that out of thin air is what it feels like.

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Magic. You know, it could be corporate, it could be entertainment, but it's something new

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and different. You know, that's what's wonderful to me about it. Or like,

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in its best times, that's what it is, you know,

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maybe the worst times, it's, you know, 3am and you're loading out, but

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that's the worst. But the best time is that magic that you created. You know,

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it's the anticipation leading up to the, you know, audience coming

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in, like that walk in, music hits, the ballyhoo goes, right? And, you know,

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the audience walks into the theater, as it were, you know, and into that ballroom.

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And it's those butterflies that you get. And, you know, there's nothing that

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beats it. It's nothing. Nothing. It's incredible. So what,

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what were some of the first jobs that you actually, you know, were able to

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buy groceries after you did that actually paid you?

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Yeah, well, luckily during college, you know,

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I got pulled into doing a lot of different things, like I invariably

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do, right? But I got pulled into one of the film organizations

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planning and showing films on theater at campus. And that actually

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led to being pulled into helping to organize and

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plan some of the film programs for several large science fiction and world

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cons. Oh, cool. So if you're not familiar, they're basically very

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large conventions that, you know, people who are fans of science fiction, either

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books or movies, whatever, come to. And it is a massive event,

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a series of events. Like there are tons of these. So I was part

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of the planning team for that through college for a lot of years. And it

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was amazing because I was able to observe and learn all the

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aspects of planning and managing these larger events because there were

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hotel contexts, there was registration, F&B, AV programming,

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VIP and speaker coordination. There was award shows, art auctions, like

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everything imaginable. And I was great because, you know, I was there for

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my expertise, right? But it was amazing training grounds while I was in

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college and learning about the industry and what

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it is and how to do it, and that partied really well into more

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actual paid events. I. That one, I probably wasn't paid all that much. I guess

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my first paid event was at a summer Renaissance festival as a

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street performer. I was actually paid for this. So I was a sword fighter. I

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was teaching. I was doing stage combat choreography. I was playing the sets and the

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performance. I was even a jouster for a couple of years. So

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that was probably my first paid. Man, that sounds like hard work too.

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Oh, my gosh. Like, incredible. Like the, you know, the, the.

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The street performance aside is you're wearing Elizabethan garb,

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right? You know, so it's wool and heavy and so forth, and you're sweating your

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butt off because you're running around, you're fighting all these stuff. The jousting is

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massively heavy gear that you're falling off of horses on all the

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time in the heat of the summer. Yeah, yeah, it's, it's. They don't

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pay nearly enough.

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So you founded varela back in

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1992. So when you quit a while ago.

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Yeah, so it was a minute. It was a minute ago. But at the time,

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what was your vision when you started the company and how has that evolved

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through the years? Because I do think visions do, you know, they tend to

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change through decades. Years. So what was it when you

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started? Well, you know, other than

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food and being able to pay rent, Big Bon number one

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goal. So it's really good. Bernadette and I actually

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love to do a lot of different things, as you can tell from what I've

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been saying all along. Right. So she's exactly the same. So we knew we wanted

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to travel the world. We knew we wanted to meet like tons of

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people. We wanted each project that we worked on to be a unique

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experience, right? So when we looked at our options, we decided that

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feature films were just way too limiting. Like you're on a movie for years and

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years. TV's even worse, right? It's every day is the same for just decades.

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And it surprised us, but we actually fell in love with corporate work

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because every single client and every single project

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is completely different. So like we could be completely

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nosy and learn like new things and meet new people every

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single day. So it fed this desire of ours to

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be able to solve new challenges

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and geek out about other people's businesses. So we started the company

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and doing video production. And because again, that played

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into every video project was unique and new and so forth and again,

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paid bills. And what happened is that over

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time we evolved because we kept growing into being able to do other things

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in production. And that came from our backgrounds. Like, you know, I was a

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photographer, I was a programmer, I was on stage, right. I did all

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these things. Bernie was the same. She was a shooter editor, like animator, like all

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of this stuff. And we love that. So as we did more and more of

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these projects, we evolved more towards events because we were doing

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videos where we would do like an opening video, a transition video, a teaser video.

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We do that on site recordings and live switching the post event recaps. Like all

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of those things kept drawing us further and further into events. And

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our clients loved what we produced and they wanted us to take on a larger

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role every single year. So we've grown and expanded

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and contracted as well. So like in the many first

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started days, you know, we rode the technology wave as something

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came out that was new and different. We would explore it, we would learn about

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it because we love learning new things. And then we would decide if it was

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appropriate for our clients or not. Like some things just were like, well, that was

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cool, but no, right? Yeah, a lot of things. We would try a new thing,

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we would learn it, we roll it out, we would ride that for a while

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and then slowly but surely we would, you know, modify it and

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try something new as event and video technology

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events. So I'll give you an example. During COVID like

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pre Covid, we were starting to actually play with virtual meetings. Like we were

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exploring like Zoom and started actually had an agreement with Zoom, like

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before everything, before it was cool. Before it was cool,

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right? So like we had started that, we started looking at like, oh, what can

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we do with virtual like environments and

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platforms? So we started that Covid hit and so

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it exploded. So we hired on a bunch of people. Like we

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over tripled our staff during COVID because we were

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doing so many meetings. But it was more importantly an

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opportunity for us to bring on people from live events,

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like in person events and theater, who were

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suffering horribly, like completely out of work. And we brought them on, we hired

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them on, we trained them up, we upskilled all of them to do what they

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wanted to do. And, and we helped service our clients who were in a pinch

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and needed to do really high end work. Great

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ways of connecting with your audience, but in a totally different venue and a totally

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different platform, trained all these people up, did all sorts of great

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stuff, and then at the end of it, they all went back to their passions,

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they went back to their lives and we've evolved into something else which is again

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much more focusing on the planning and organizing. So I think that's amazing.

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That's amazing. Such a cool example of being

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flexible and, and being a part of a small business allows you

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to do. You can turn on a dime, you can, you know, there's a

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guarantee that it'll look different in three years, you know, so as

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long as you're willing, like, you know what I hear from that is you guys

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are always exploring new technology, always curious, willing

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to completely change the game over and over again.

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I mean, these are resilient skills. But I will take a

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moment and I, I think that, you know, the way

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that you guys produce virtual events now and

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for people that produce events or have an event

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portfolio, really keeping in mind that virtual

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events are still such a powerful tool to use

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in an environment where you're being asked to do more with less.

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So, like, if you have a whole annual portfolio of events, maybe you

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should look through each of them and. And deploy virtual

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on some of them if you're being asked to do more.

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But not anymore, because they can be super impactful, especially

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when they're utilized correctly. You know, the lessons we learned about,

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okay, we can do, maybe the programming needs to be

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shorter, but it can be really impactful, you know, or how can we keep people

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engaged in this? There, there's some great ways to do it. So I

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still think it's such a valid format, you know, even though

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it is a lot of fun to do live events. And that seems to be

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the primary right now. Yeah, I mean, you know, theater background, like in

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person, that is the holy grail. That's what you want to do. But there is,

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as you said, a ton of very important reasons to do virtual.

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We did a program in the height of COVID

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and we actually looked back at the data

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and the metrics from pre Covid meetings in person to the

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ones that we did virtually. And

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the amazing thing was, is that we reached a lot more people that had

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bigger audience doing the virtual side of things and had a bigger impact than we

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did in person. So for example, this was a global event.

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They had approximately, and I don't have the numbers in front of me, but they

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were approximately 40 countries that they reached out to. We were

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up to 65 countries. During virtual, the audience doubled

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for the people that could afford to come. And it's a great equalizer. Virtual

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is one of those things that's underrated because it allows you to reach out, especially

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in corporate, to a huge audience. Right. Not

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everybody has the budget to be able to send their people

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all the way across the world to something. A lot of our clients have events

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that we hold in Europe, for example. Right. And if you're a smaller

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team in Asia Pacific, latam someplace else, they

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can send maybe one person in person and that person gets an amazing

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experience. But if you have a really good virtual or

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hybrid experience, their entire team can participate.

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Like, the impact is massive. Like, there's so many more

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people that can actually join in, participate and be affected

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by the content and the information being provided on a one, on one really

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close basis versus hearing it secondhand. There's a lot

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to be said for that. That's right. And once you've invested in that

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initial package to like actually put on that, that

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streaming event, the, the Cost to add

316
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attendees is just very small. Very small. Yeah.

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So economies of scale. Yeah. Well, and one of the other

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things too that is important to remember is that there are

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no very few standalone in person events

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that only happen in that room. We have a couple. Right. But more and

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more, every single program that we're producing, we have to think about. All

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right. Even if there isn't going to be planned

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for a virtual, you still have to set up for it. Right? Because invariably

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you're going to have a virtual presenter who turns virtual because this has all

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happened. They've gotten sick, they've missed their plane and you know, they can't make

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it. They have another thing, somebody else's. So you're always

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preparing for that. Right. So to your point, it's not much more to

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plan for having that ability to do. And if you start at the very beginning

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and start planning it, you know, then you can have a huge impact and

330
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promote it and bring them in because again, you're going to have to

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broadcast out to that one presenter and have them come in anyway. Why

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not just make it hybrid? That's right. That's right. I love it.

333
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I. It's such a great. And, and the world.

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The adoption of the technology was pushed forward about 10 years over

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Covid. So everybody knows how, you know,

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like, I think if Covid didn't happen, people would still be kind of like, I

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don't want to, it's not, I don't want to learn it. You know, now everybody

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had to, you know, look at our kids, you know, going up through school

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and graduating through a lot of that. They, they now expect that in education.

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So there's a whole generation that's just part of it. That's. That's one way you

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can do events, you know. Yeah, yeah. And I think you're right.

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The silver lining of that was like, because we did a bunch of K through

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12 higher education, distance learning work back

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a long time ago, before it was cool. And it was

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a struggle. Like people just didn't get it. They couldn't get into it. Like

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it was much harder. Now for all of the challenges that Covid

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brought, right. There are so many things that people are now comfortable for

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doing things like this. Right. Never would have been able to do this 10 years

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ago or being able to like hop on a quick call or

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do like meeting after meeting around the world. Like I get up early and I

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do meetings in Europe, you know, I'm late for meetings in Asia. Like

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that's the new normal. It's Easy to do that. And we wouldn't have had any

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of that if technology hadn't had this massive increase

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and ramp up that we had to have. See, we're both, I think

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we're both a bit of optimists too, because we're seeing the glass half full

356
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part of. COVID half full

357
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is absolutely. Yeah. Not, you know, half empty. Yeah, yeah, it

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was rough, but there were some good things that came out of it. But as

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far as you have a background in theater and film, so how has that influenced

360
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the way you design and produce corporate events over your, your career?

361
00:21:57,250 --> 00:22:00,930
Yeah, it's interesting. I absolutely have and we've talked about this. Like,

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I have a audience first mindset, right. So the first

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thing I think about on every program is what will engage the audience, what will

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make moments memorable, what will want them, make them leave wanting more

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to want to come back for next night or to pay for that second ticket.

366
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Right. So I'm always looking at the, the science of

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engagement and retention, which again comes both from my theater and film

368
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side. But also as I mentioned, like, we did some work in training for years

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for K through 12 and higher ed. And so I was always having to think

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about that, like, what was it that would engage the audience? What would keep people

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to, you know, reading, to save, participate instead of

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checking out, like, what would actually trigger them to remember something? What

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was that memory that would spark retention? So, you

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know, if the students or our audience. Right. Is not engaging or retaining

375
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the content and having those long term memories, then

376
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why are we doing it? Why are we spending the time and money? Right. So

377
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that is the important thing. So the theater and the film side of things really

378
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plays into asking the question of why are we doing this?

379
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How can we make it better and how can we actually allow them to

380
00:23:04,800 --> 00:23:08,590
retain? So I really love starting

381
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a project and mapping out the story of the program. So I, I,

382
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I. We've talked about this before, but I love meeting at the very beginning

383
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of the planning stages to talk about the goals and the outcomes and what success

384
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looks like for the business owners. Even before we decide on things

385
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like dates and locations and agenda and is it an

386
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LED wall or projection light? Start by like going, what are

387
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you trying to accomplish? What are your goals? What's success look

388
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like? How do we get there? How do we make the audience love

389
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the experience, you know, and then from that everything else

390
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follows, Everything else just rolls into place. Yeah, I'm a big

391
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fan of clients coming very early to their production

392
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partners. Bring them in, even if you can build relationship

393
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and start avoiding even the RFP phase. I don't think

394
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that's like abdicating on

395
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your responsibility. I think that you've done a good job finding a good partner,

396
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you know, and if you do bring them in and let them, you know, what

397
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you're. You're implying we create a story arc for a whole corporate

398
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event and then we can plan everything else around it. And

399
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if they. People don't remember, like, what you just said, what's the point?

400
00:24:19,150 --> 00:24:22,830
So, yeah, I think that's powerful, but tying back to what we were saying

401
00:24:24,030 --> 00:24:27,760
about virtual. So is there a difference then about how you

402
00:24:27,760 --> 00:24:30,880
approach engagement for live audiences versus

403
00:24:31,040 --> 00:24:34,640
virtual audiences? You know, in this, in this thought

404
00:24:34,640 --> 00:24:38,240
of, like, how you're creating the story of, of your event,

405
00:24:38,640 --> 00:24:42,400
how would you advise event planners when they're thinking about,

406
00:24:42,720 --> 00:24:46,480
okay, we are going to have like a virtual component, so what are we thinking

407
00:24:46,480 --> 00:24:50,280
about? Yeah. And, and the short answer, is there a

408
00:24:50,280 --> 00:24:54,130
difference? Yes and no. Right. Obviously, there's technical differences. You know,

409
00:24:54,130 --> 00:24:57,850
there's different technologies. But if you go back to the very beginning,

410
00:24:57,850 --> 00:25:01,650
you look at the underlying goals and objectives, they're absolutely the same.

411
00:25:01,650 --> 00:25:05,450
Right? Yeah. The challenge, of course, with virtual, and we've talked

412
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about this just a few minutes ago, but, like, I think it's really hard and

413
00:25:08,890 --> 00:25:12,130
it's much more important to engage for virtual. So you have to work a lot

414
00:25:12,130 --> 00:25:15,970
harder. Like, virtual is not easier, Virtual is harder, and obviously

415
00:25:15,970 --> 00:25:19,630
hybrid is even harder. But, like, you need to think

416
00:25:19,630 --> 00:25:23,390
about things like adding in polls. Right. You need to make sure

417
00:25:23,390 --> 00:25:27,230
you're changing presenters and media, like, every 10 minutes.

418
00:25:27,230 --> 00:25:30,470
You need to find ways to call on the audience more frequently for Q and

419
00:25:30,470 --> 00:25:33,830
A. Don't just wait till the end, but, like, break it up. Right? Because, you

420
00:25:33,830 --> 00:25:36,710
know, they're used to having

421
00:25:37,670 --> 00:25:41,470
constant, you know, feedback, constant attention. But if they don't for

422
00:25:41,470 --> 00:25:44,710
a while, they're going to check out, they're going to go to the kitchen. Right.

423
00:25:44,710 --> 00:25:47,950
You know, they're waiting for a commercial break. Right, Right. So you

424
00:25:47,950 --> 00:25:51,550
absolutely need to do all of those things. You need to find ways to see

425
00:25:51,550 --> 00:25:54,950
your attendees on screen, find ways to bring them in.

426
00:25:55,190 --> 00:25:58,230
And it doesn't have to be like a gallery view of everybody all the time.

427
00:25:58,630 --> 00:26:02,310
But it's amazing when you pull one person in and

428
00:26:02,310 --> 00:26:05,790
bring them up on camera from the audience, suddenly everyone is freaking out in the

429
00:26:05,790 --> 00:26:09,550
audience because, like, I could be next. So now they're engaged again.

430
00:26:09,550 --> 00:26:13,270
Like, they're really connected. So a lot of things like that. There's also

431
00:26:13,270 --> 00:26:16,300
things you have to do from the standpoint of video. You know,

432
00:26:17,100 --> 00:26:20,220
some things work better in virtual, some things don't. Right. So you always have to

433
00:26:20,220 --> 00:26:23,940
play that. But it's this idea that as virtual and

434
00:26:23,940 --> 00:26:27,660
this is the, the problem that we had at the end of the pandemic with

435
00:26:27,660 --> 00:26:31,180
zoom and teams is you're competing with not in person,

436
00:26:31,419 --> 00:26:35,220
you're competing with tv. Right. So if your shows are

437
00:26:35,220 --> 00:26:37,660
not broadcast quality for virtual. Right.

438
00:26:38,700 --> 00:26:41,980
That's who your competition is. So you need to be using things like VMIX and

439
00:26:41,980 --> 00:26:45,730
other tools to create like multi up pips, different looks and branding. You need to

440
00:26:45,730 --> 00:26:48,690
be thinking about green screen studios for your presenters and full

441
00:26:48,690 --> 00:26:52,290
backdrops that you have them walking on like you would, you know, for like

442
00:26:52,290 --> 00:26:56,050
Sportscenter or something. So it's a much more elevated visual

443
00:26:56,050 --> 00:26:59,890
experience to make up for that lack of in person

444
00:27:00,050 --> 00:27:03,650
contact that you have in a room in person. Right. So

445
00:27:03,970 --> 00:27:07,650
you're fighting those zoom and team stereotypes and it's definitely

446
00:27:07,650 --> 00:27:11,090
a lot harder to achieve the same impact. Yeah.

447
00:27:12,020 --> 00:27:15,660
So yeah, yeah, yeah, I think you're right. I think production, high

448
00:27:15,660 --> 00:27:19,220
production is like the table stakes. That's just the starting point.

449
00:27:19,300 --> 00:27:22,900
And then you get into your story but keeping it quick, keeping the, the

450
00:27:22,900 --> 00:27:26,660
pacing tighter. It's kind of like radio was, you

451
00:27:26,660 --> 00:27:29,580
know, like you don't ever want dead air. You know, you got to keep it

452
00:27:29,580 --> 00:27:33,220
moving. Yep. Oh yeah. I had a radio, tv

453
00:27:33,300 --> 00:27:36,620
radio show for a while. Right. You know, again, one of the thousand many things

454
00:27:36,620 --> 00:27:40,350
I did. And, and it was hard to plan that out. And then

455
00:27:40,350 --> 00:27:43,710
as soon as you had the visual element. Absolutely. And then the event is the

456
00:27:43,710 --> 00:27:47,430
personal element. Right. You not only have the audio side of things, you not only

457
00:27:47,430 --> 00:27:50,990
have the visual side of things, but now you have that inner communication, that connection,

458
00:27:51,470 --> 00:27:54,670
networking with people that you have to play in. Yeah, yeah.

459
00:27:55,390 --> 00:27:59,110
It is a lot of work to make it happen. Right. But when it's

460
00:27:59,110 --> 00:28:02,190
done well as an attendee, it feels right. It's magic. It feels right.

461
00:28:03,560 --> 00:28:07,120
So what do you think has changed the most in corporate events since you

462
00:28:07,120 --> 00:28:08,600
guys started Brella?

463
00:28:13,160 --> 00:28:16,760
There has been a lot that has changed,

464
00:28:17,160 --> 00:28:21,000
I think. So obviously we just talked about this. First thing is, is every

465
00:28:21,000 --> 00:28:23,800
in person is now hiring. Right. So you got to plan for that. Like

466
00:28:24,600 --> 00:28:27,400
you have to plan for how do you engage the audience, how do you have

467
00:28:27,400 --> 00:28:31,200
to have participation from remote audience. You always need to plan for those virtual presenters

468
00:28:31,200 --> 00:28:34,860
and the communication feedback challenges. Right. So all of that has to be planned for

469
00:28:34,860 --> 00:28:37,820
in advance. It's not something that you can just like turn on at the last

470
00:28:37,820 --> 00:28:41,500
minute. Hey, can we actually add a virtual audience, you know, in

471
00:28:41,500 --> 00:28:44,900
five minutes when we're. No, no. Like cameras, audio

472
00:28:45,060 --> 00:28:48,420
mix minus like feedback. Like there's so much. So

473
00:28:48,740 --> 00:28:52,420
I think first thing is, is obviously, you know, the big change is that

474
00:28:52,420 --> 00:28:56,060
everything is. Is hybrid now and you have to think about different

475
00:28:56,060 --> 00:28:59,620
audiences. Not just your audience in the room, but your audience that's around the world.

476
00:28:59,940 --> 00:29:03,380
And how do you not just connect with them, but also how do you localize

477
00:29:03,380 --> 00:29:07,140
it for them? Like your audience isn't just one demographic, it's

478
00:29:07,140 --> 00:29:10,940
thousands of demographics. So that's a big change and a huge

479
00:29:10,940 --> 00:29:14,620
thing for the future. I think one of the other big changes that

480
00:29:14,620 --> 00:29:18,260
have occurred is there's a lot more opportunities for

481
00:29:18,340 --> 00:29:22,060
creative engagement using technology like LED walls. Now

482
00:29:22,060 --> 00:29:25,700
they're at such a low price compared to what they used to be that

483
00:29:26,180 --> 00:29:29,420
you have to think about that. We did a show in Bangkok and it was

484
00:29:29,420 --> 00:29:33,160
actually significantly more expensive to use projection than

485
00:29:33,160 --> 00:29:36,520
the walls because the walls were a so cheap. But also, more

486
00:29:36,520 --> 00:29:39,760
importantly, they were easy to set up and anybody could run them.

487
00:29:40,960 --> 00:29:44,600
Doing a blend in a projector is a

488
00:29:44,600 --> 00:29:47,680
lost art. Like that was very expensive, right?

489
00:29:48,400 --> 00:29:52,240
Hard to do. It's an absolute skill. Nobody there had it, right? So

490
00:29:52,800 --> 00:29:56,120
it has become a lot cheaper. So you know, what used to be a simple

491
00:29:56,120 --> 00:29:59,360
corporate meeting with a pair of like flanking projected screens.

492
00:29:59,760 --> 00:30:03,400
Now instead is like LED walls. Immersive elements

493
00:30:03,400 --> 00:30:07,120
inside and outside the room. Real time feedback from

494
00:30:07,120 --> 00:30:10,520
the audience, whether they're on screen or just using tools like

495
00:30:10,840 --> 00:30:14,520
mentimeter or Slido. Right. It's an active audience

496
00:30:14,600 --> 00:30:18,160
versus a passive audience. So that's a massive change that's

497
00:30:18,160 --> 00:30:21,960
happened is you have a lot more technology and you have

498
00:30:21,960 --> 00:30:25,480
to live up to the technology. You have a broader base of audience,

499
00:30:25,720 --> 00:30:29,380
both virtual and in person. And you need

500
00:30:29,380 --> 00:30:32,780
to have that audience be engaged using polls and word

501
00:30:32,780 --> 00:30:36,140
clouds and feedback from them and Q and A submissions and

502
00:30:36,140 --> 00:30:39,580
moderation. Like, it's just gotten a lot more complicated,

503
00:30:40,140 --> 00:30:43,700
a lot more fun, right? There's a lot more from a

504
00:30:43,700 --> 00:30:46,860
technical perspective, super fun. But

505
00:30:48,060 --> 00:30:51,900
I think you're right, man. There's so much technology

506
00:30:52,060 --> 00:30:55,740
that's going on. And I also am thinking the environment right now.

507
00:30:55,820 --> 00:30:59,560
So everywhere you go, you go to a sporting event,

508
00:30:59,800 --> 00:31:03,240
you go to theater, you go see a touring

509
00:31:03,320 --> 00:31:06,920
act, you go to church, everywhere you

510
00:31:06,920 --> 00:31:09,960
go, production is such a high level.

511
00:31:10,520 --> 00:31:14,360
And what I've. The biggest thing that's changed over my career

512
00:31:14,360 --> 00:31:17,720
is things that used to be like wow are like

513
00:31:18,120 --> 00:31:21,680
common. And so it Kind of comes full circle

514
00:31:21,680 --> 00:31:25,230
back to what you've been talking about. If you're

515
00:31:25,390 --> 00:31:29,190
thinking about your, what story are you telling

516
00:31:29,190 --> 00:31:33,030
and create a compelling narrative through three days at your

517
00:31:33,030 --> 00:31:36,670
event or whatever it is, it starts giving a real

518
00:31:36,830 --> 00:31:40,670
reason, like a tangible reason to come to your event or attend

519
00:31:40,670 --> 00:31:44,390
your event. Yeah, all of the production is great for people

520
00:31:44,390 --> 00:31:47,550
like us. It's super fun to do, but also

521
00:31:48,270 --> 00:31:51,890
pretty common. What's not as common is the way that

522
00:31:51,890 --> 00:31:55,730
you're talking about thinking of really sitting down for

523
00:31:55,730 --> 00:31:59,490
a minute before you write that RFP or before you get down the road

524
00:31:59,490 --> 00:32:03,170
on what tech you're going to use and think about what you want people to

525
00:32:03,170 --> 00:32:06,330
walk away from the event with. How, how are you going to make

526
00:32:06,330 --> 00:32:09,810
impressions on your attendees in a way that's

527
00:32:09,810 --> 00:32:13,290
impactful and meaningful? And I think that is, it becomes like a competitive

528
00:32:13,290 --> 00:32:17,000
advantage, which I'm, all I'm saying is event planners, you need to talk to,

529
00:32:17,150 --> 00:32:20,990
to Mark because people like Mark can help you

530
00:32:20,990 --> 00:32:23,630
create something that's that much more

531
00:32:24,430 --> 00:32:27,950
impactful in a, in a really crowded market of events.

532
00:32:28,110 --> 00:32:31,670
You know, quite frankly, you know, when you look at your calendar as an attendee

533
00:32:31,670 --> 00:32:34,310
and you're trying to. These are my anchor events I'm going to go to this

534
00:32:34,310 --> 00:32:37,470
year. It's pretty competitive, you know, so I want to go to one. If I'm

535
00:32:37,470 --> 00:32:39,630
going to spend the money, I want to go to one that makes an impact

536
00:32:39,630 --> 00:32:43,270
on my life and. I get something out of it that I learned something, that

537
00:32:43,270 --> 00:32:47,110
I'm engaged. Right? Yeah. You know, the thing that,

538
00:32:47,110 --> 00:32:50,730
that always baffles me is the lack of

539
00:32:50,810 --> 00:32:54,610
amount of pre production spot time that is allocated in the

540
00:32:54,610 --> 00:32:58,010
budget and in the planning. Your event is

541
00:32:59,210 --> 00:33:02,610
5% out of the 95% that

542
00:33:02,610 --> 00:33:06,210
remains of the time that's required. So if you look at an event and you

543
00:33:06,210 --> 00:33:10,010
go, wow, all right, I've got one week is my on site

544
00:33:10,010 --> 00:33:13,490
event, right. Maybe a couple of days for a load in, etc. Right. But that's,

545
00:33:13,490 --> 00:33:17,330
that's, that's where I'm running all of my energy and all my

546
00:33:17,330 --> 00:33:21,130
thought process too. All of the other time. That

547
00:33:21,130 --> 00:33:24,810
95% of the time is where the magic really happens. It's in the

548
00:33:24,810 --> 00:33:28,450
planning, it's in the organizing, it's in the brainstorming with all of your partners. It's

549
00:33:28,450 --> 00:33:32,250
figuring it out. And the sooner you do that, the

550
00:33:32,250 --> 00:33:36,050
more impactful it's going to be. You have less costs

551
00:33:36,050 --> 00:33:39,890
because you're not doing U turns. Right. You are able to book

552
00:33:39,890 --> 00:33:43,690
your crew and your talent Way in advance, because you planned it out. Your creative

553
00:33:43,690 --> 00:33:47,540
agencies are able to actually have something well in advance, so they're not

554
00:33:47,540 --> 00:33:51,100
rushing and doing stuff in OT and over weekends because they have weeks

555
00:33:51,100 --> 00:33:54,700
and months to think about. Like, I've seen after the site

556
00:33:54,700 --> 00:33:58,340
survey what the place looks like. I've received all of the pictures. I have the

557
00:33:58,340 --> 00:34:01,420
floor plans. We know what the AV the room set's going to be. We know

558
00:34:01,420 --> 00:34:05,220
what AV we got. We've negotiated in between all of us, between the AV

559
00:34:05,220 --> 00:34:08,780
and creative side about what type of LED wall, how wide is it, what's the

560
00:34:08,780 --> 00:34:12,500
ratio? What's the pixel pitch? Oh, it's 1.9. Great. That's going to

561
00:34:12,500 --> 00:34:16,210
allow us to do X, Y, and Z. Here's the resolution. Like, they can

562
00:34:16,359 --> 00:34:20,199
do all of that in advance. They can produce the video clips, let's say,

563
00:34:20,199 --> 00:34:23,999
in the backgrounds. Once instead of getting on site and, like, freaking

564
00:34:23,999 --> 00:34:27,719
out because it's a different ratio, you act like it's a different

565
00:34:27,719 --> 00:34:31,399
resolution. I've never seen this before, right? So those are the things

566
00:34:31,399 --> 00:34:34,999
that I absolutely love is, is the sooner the

567
00:34:34,999 --> 00:34:38,839
better. And. And this is probably like, if I have to be

568
00:34:38,839 --> 00:34:42,189
on a soapbox for absolutely anything, right? As you said, like,

569
00:34:42,579 --> 00:34:46,379
embrace your partners and bring them in early. Rely on your experts to give you

570
00:34:46,379 --> 00:34:49,539
recommendations on how to elevate that audience experience.

571
00:34:50,099 --> 00:34:53,539
It's their job, it's their passion.

572
00:34:53,939 --> 00:34:57,619
Rely on them. Don't get me wrong,

573
00:34:57,779 --> 00:35:01,179
I love. One of my favorite things to do is to manage this ensemble of

574
00:35:01,179 --> 00:35:04,179
partners, right? You know, if you want to think in theater, it's the actors, the

575
00:35:04,179 --> 00:35:07,939
tech crew, the craft services, transportation writers, right? But it's exactly the

576
00:35:07,939 --> 00:35:11,610
same in events, right? So listen to their ideas, suggestions, and

577
00:35:11,610 --> 00:35:15,370
recommendations. You don't need to do this alone. Let the

578
00:35:15,370 --> 00:35:19,210
professionals who you're paying to be experts, be experts. Let

579
00:35:19,210 --> 00:35:22,810
them do their jobs and bring them in early. That's

580
00:35:22,810 --> 00:35:26,410
it. That's all. I never need to do another podcast. That was a great

581
00:35:26,410 --> 00:35:30,130
summary of if people could

582
00:35:30,130 --> 00:35:33,890
embrace that mindset. And, you know, I think that is

583
00:35:33,890 --> 00:35:37,490
a. That's the way I feel about it. I also think

584
00:35:37,650 --> 00:35:41,310
event planners are struggling because that's like, they want to get to that point.

585
00:35:41,550 --> 00:35:45,230
But I was having breakfast with a group of planners this week,

586
00:35:45,310 --> 00:35:49,030
and there's limitations on what they get. They're, like,

587
00:35:49,030 --> 00:35:52,790
stuck in the middle of, like, we know about the events, but I have no

588
00:35:52,790 --> 00:35:56,390
info until three weeks out. You know, it's like they're in this weird

589
00:35:56,390 --> 00:36:00,110
thing. So your partner, you know, we want to be There as early as

590
00:36:00,110 --> 00:36:03,630
possible. Hey, if you only have three weeks, we'll. We'll try.

591
00:36:03,630 --> 00:36:07,470
We'll. We'll do our best. We'll do. Okay. Like, I'm literally have one that is

592
00:36:07,470 --> 00:36:10,950
two weeks out and we're still struggling to get information. Right. I. I get it.

593
00:36:10,950 --> 00:36:13,870
I totally understand. I will say use us

594
00:36:14,590 --> 00:36:18,350
as a tool, as an excuse, as a crutch, as a

595
00:36:18,590 --> 00:36:22,310
crowbar to get information out. You know, hey, you know, the

596
00:36:22,310 --> 00:36:25,950
creative agency, the AV partner, they need to know this information.

597
00:36:26,830 --> 00:36:29,990
Bring them into a meeting. Like, have us ask those

598
00:36:29,990 --> 00:36:33,350
questions for you so you don't feel like you have to be the bad guy.

599
00:36:33,350 --> 00:36:36,030
Right. You know, you can have us go, hey, so we just want to make

600
00:36:36,030 --> 00:36:39,780
sure we have enough microphones. Tell us a little bit about this panel.

601
00:36:39,780 --> 00:36:42,860
What are you thinking? How's it starting? Is there a moderator? Do you need tools?

602
00:36:42,860 --> 00:36:46,700
Like, and then we can bring all of those questions up front and then suddenly

603
00:36:46,700 --> 00:36:49,940
you're in the background as a planner, like, write all these massive notes because, like,

604
00:36:49,940 --> 00:36:53,540
suddenly they mentioned, oh, yeah, yeah, we probably do need actually a break

605
00:36:53,540 --> 00:36:57,060
afterwards. And so we're gonna need some F and B or, you know, oh, yeah,

606
00:36:57,060 --> 00:36:59,700
we need a rehearsal. Oh, we need to set up the date. I guess I

607
00:36:59,700 --> 00:37:03,540
should book that room a day early for setup. Like, let us help you

608
00:37:03,540 --> 00:37:06,860
with those things because, you know, we can always find ways to

609
00:37:07,970 --> 00:37:11,810
bring those questions to your client to ask them so you don't have

610
00:37:11,810 --> 00:37:15,490
to and then. Right. It keeps you out of asking those hard questions. Yes.

611
00:37:15,810 --> 00:37:19,410
I love it. I love that. Well, what do you think

612
00:37:20,450 --> 00:37:23,329
as we're wrapping up here, what do you think corporate events will look like in

613
00:37:23,329 --> 00:37:27,130
10 years? Hard

614
00:37:27,130 --> 00:37:30,610
question. Big crystal ball, very close. Nobody knows. I'll just

615
00:37:30,610 --> 00:37:34,220
preface it with that nobody knows. I think there are a

616
00:37:34,220 --> 00:37:37,420
couple of standard things that I can see in 10 years. So

617
00:37:38,460 --> 00:37:42,300
I think that corporate events are going to continue to evolve and

618
00:37:42,300 --> 00:37:46,140
focus more on connections and relationships. Right?

619
00:37:46,220 --> 00:37:50,020
So knowledge is going to be easily available. It's online, it's

620
00:37:50,020 --> 00:37:53,340
via AI. At some point, we're going to have neural implants, right. Where it feeds

621
00:37:53,340 --> 00:37:57,180
it directly into our brain. But, like, those connections of, like, face

622
00:37:57,180 --> 00:38:00,980
to face and face to face is either in person or what we're doing

623
00:38:00,980 --> 00:38:04,620
right now. Like, I consider this face to face, Seth. Like, I love

624
00:38:04,620 --> 00:38:08,460
this conversation because you and I can have a great conversation on

625
00:38:08,620 --> 00:38:12,180
this. And we know that, you know, we're getting something out of it. So any

626
00:38:12,180 --> 00:38:15,980
sort of connection can't be replaced. And I think this is going

627
00:38:15,980 --> 00:38:19,420
to be really important because it's going to help build

628
00:38:19,420 --> 00:38:22,380
authentic moments and trust. Like

629
00:38:23,020 --> 00:38:26,510
deep, deep fake video is easy now and it will be

630
00:38:26,510 --> 00:38:30,190
completely indistinguishable. Like, but in person it's

631
00:38:30,190 --> 00:38:33,670
much harder to fake. Even this is much harder to fake. Right? Yeah.

632
00:38:33,910 --> 00:38:36,950
So I believe that there will be a lot more events, but I'm going to

633
00:38:36,950 --> 00:38:40,630
believe that they're actually going to be much more intimate and focused.

634
00:38:40,630 --> 00:38:44,310
Right. So brainstorming, working sessions mixed with

635
00:38:44,630 --> 00:38:48,390
team building and networking and community building. Like, so there will be all of

636
00:38:48,390 --> 00:38:52,030
these very small focus, intimate events and it's going to be much more about

637
00:38:52,030 --> 00:38:55,410
unique locations, venues and experiences than like

638
00:38:55,490 --> 00:38:59,290
large cities and large congress centers. This actually just brought up something for me.

639
00:38:59,290 --> 00:39:03,090
Like I literally two weeks ago was in Barcelona doing an event

640
00:39:03,170 --> 00:39:06,690
for about 120 people

641
00:39:07,250 --> 00:39:10,530
in like this all inclusive sort of corporate retreat.

642
00:39:10,850 --> 00:39:13,890
And it was amazing because everyone was

643
00:39:14,290 --> 00:39:18,010
focused. It was 45 minutes from the airport. They couldn't sneak out

644
00:39:18,010 --> 00:39:21,770
and go shopping. Right. Like, you were stuck there and there were activities, there were

645
00:39:21,770 --> 00:39:24,890
bike rides and like all sorts of things and massive amounts of food. It was

646
00:39:24,890 --> 00:39:28,390
phenomenal experience. Right. But it was much more

647
00:39:28,390 --> 00:39:31,790
about getting in a room, talking with each other,

648
00:39:31,950 --> 00:39:35,790
doing workshops, communicating really quickly. Those were

649
00:39:35,790 --> 00:39:39,470
those moments that were very intense and

650
00:39:39,470 --> 00:39:42,909
very productive because they were super efficient versus

651
00:39:43,150 --> 00:39:46,550
a large congress center, a large sort of thing. So I think they're going to

652
00:39:46,550 --> 00:39:50,150
evolve into much more about why do we meet in

653
00:39:50,150 --> 00:39:54,000
person. We meet in person to have connections and it's easier to make connections in

654
00:39:54,000 --> 00:39:57,840
smaller groups in places that are unique and different and we haven't all been

655
00:39:57,840 --> 00:40:01,600
to before. So there's my tenure. I love that vision of the

656
00:40:01,600 --> 00:40:05,280
future. So I'm hoping for that. And you guys are definitely poised

657
00:40:05,280 --> 00:40:08,960
to be a creative partner with event planners to create those

658
00:40:08,960 --> 00:40:12,800
moments. So I really appreciate your insight into how you think

659
00:40:12,800 --> 00:40:16,440
about events and for taking time with us today. Thank you, Mark, so

660
00:40:16,440 --> 00:40:20,010
much. You are very welcome. Happy to do it. Well,

661
00:40:20,090 --> 00:40:23,730
thank you for joining us on this episode of the Event Pro

662
00:40:23,730 --> 00:40:27,410
show. Mark, how can we find out more about you and

663
00:40:27,410 --> 00:40:30,250
Brella? Yeah, absolutely. Well,

664
00:40:30,810 --> 00:40:34,650
obviously LinkedIn, if you search Brella or if you search

665
00:40:34,650 --> 00:40:38,490
for my name, you know, look up Melchalk M A L L C H

666
00:40:38,490 --> 00:40:42,250
O K. You can also find me. I think my one is actually brella

667
00:40:42,250 --> 00:40:45,530
mm on LinkedIn. So that's great. The Brella website.

668
00:40:46,170 --> 00:40:49,970
Find my email, call me. Like, I love, as you

669
00:40:49,970 --> 00:40:53,810
can tell, I love talking about this stuff. Right. I love to talk

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about these topics. I love sharing experiences and learnings. I was

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lucky. I learned from some amazing mentors. I've experienced

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00:41:01,130 --> 00:41:04,810
a lot of amazing shows and I am happy to share anything I

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can with anybody who wants to reach out to me. Love it.

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00:41:08,730 --> 00:41:12,530
Well, thank you so much Mark, and thank you for joining us

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on this episode. If you want to see all of our wonderful guests we have

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00:41:16,250 --> 00:41:19,450
had on the Event Pro show thus far, you can go to

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00:41:19,450 --> 00:41:23,010
theeventproshow.com or go to wherever you listen to your

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00:41:23,010 --> 00:41:26,850
to your podcast, Spotify, Apple, all those wonderful

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00:41:26,850 --> 00:41:30,290
places. We will bring you a new episode about once a week.

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00:41:30,450 --> 00:41:34,010
Thank you for spending time with us today and we will see you on the

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00:41:34,010 --> 00:41:37,730
next one. The Event Pro show is a production of

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00:41:37,730 --> 00:41:41,490
LEMG video by Nick Barrett, audio

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00:41:41,490 --> 00:41:45,330
and post production by Prince Thompson. You can learn more about us at

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LEMG.